Kinkajou : Why do we need gravity drive? I can think of lots of other ways to generate a force or push to make a spaceship move.
Rockets : Today Tech
Erasmus : Well, the advantage of using gravity is that it is “massless”. This is fundamentally different from all other drive systems. Rockets throw accelerated mass out the exhaust which pushes the rocket forward. (This is also known as generating thrust). We use chemical rockets because of the speed with which they generate heat or thrust. This speed of reaction or force generation is critical to reach escape velocity quickly, such as escaping from the Earth to earth orbit.
However, we could not possibly carry enough oxygen to allow a chemical reaction to drive a spaceship. It simply weighs too much and delivers too little energy in the long term.
Rocket Launch NASA USA
Perhaps, the most common drive system “suggested” for galactic travel is some form of “ion drive” with a nuclear power plant generating magnetic fields or heat. This electrical energy or heat energy may be used to accelerate particles from the spaceship exhaust.
While this drive system uses minimal reaction mass compared to a chemical rocket, it really does not generate a lot of thrust. Some authors have quoted that typical ion drives can generate about 0.1g of thrust, (about a tenth the acceleration of gravity on earth). This type of rocket (essentially an ion drive) could not escape from the earth to earth orbit. It could however escape from the sun’s gravity well due to much more gradual gravity slope as compare to getting off the surface of the earth.
The ion drive rocket also still needs a supply of reaction mass.
Erasmus : Let’s do some basic maths. With conservation of momentum, a spaceship exhausting 10% of its mass at “c” (the speed of light), could only roughly accelerate itself to roughly 0.1c. (That is ten per cent of light speed). It would need to do the repeat same process pointed the other way to decelerate. To come home from somewhere else would then require a repeat acceleration process / deceleration process.
This adds up to about 40% of the total mass of the spaceship being reaction mass. This is not quite true since as the rocket throws out reaction mass it becomes lighter and needs less “fuel” to make it travel faster. Still since the process is less than perfectly efficient, the approximation is probably within the realms of the possible.
A gravity drive spaceship on the other hand could arrive home with essentially the same mass as it left home. This means fuelling the ship is much less of a problem than if actual reaction mass had to be replaced at the end of every journey. The entire mass of the ship would be payload. Since energy is produced by nuclear processes, where E= mc2, the mass required to generate energy, especially massless energy such as gravity particles, is minimal.
Learning to generate gravity is important for a number of other reasons. These fields may be used to assist in containment of materials such as fusion reactor core fuel or perhaps even antimatter.
The sun uses gravity to keep its matter contained within its core. The human race has mainly chosen magnetic fields because we are skilled at generating these and they can largely perform the same function, within the current limits of our knowledge. However, if we learn to generate gravity, a plethora of new options for industrial processes present themselves.
There are also the things, which no one has considered yet. We could use gravity to pump water over hills, effectively rerouting rivers or flood water. Potentially a very useful trick. We could redirect atmospheric streams of moisture laden sea air into the Australian interior, bring a burnt and blasted desert landscape back to life, enabling farming across huge areas of previously barren land.
Kinkajou : Well the suggestion has merit. But do you really think humanity can ever generate gravity.
Erasmus: Well, one thing humanity is good at is copying nature.
Currently, any lump of matter will generate gravity. For humanity, the issue is how can we make it generate a “disproportionate” amount of gravity?
Humanity currently has a 13 dimensional theory called string theory which can explain gravity. The trick is in developing useful applications from these. Once upon a time humanity had “Maxwell’s Equations describing electromagnetism. It took a surprisingly little amount of time to gain the knowledge and skill needed to generate and manipulate electromagnetism.
Kinkajou : Looking forward to this one. I think I can add a few possible alternate uses of gravity to the list, myself. For example, if we were able to lift icebergs from the Antarctic and deposit them in central Australia, the water could make the continent bloom and allow huge tracts of land to become economically productive. Gravity technology is probably relevant in a number of areas we’ve never even considered to date.
(PS: they won’t melt either as you’re transporting them because in the upper atmosphere temperatures range from -42 to -80° C. Wind chill would add an extra level of cooling or freezing to the moving berg, making the delivered icebergs even colder than when they started out.) Air conditioning?
Erasmus : I’ve seen some calculations suggesting that the Australian interior needs 250-300 km3 of water per year to make an impact on aridity in low rainfall areas and deserts.
Perhaps the answer is the gravity feed wet air masses to the interior but to use some icebergs as condensation sinks to trigger rainfall. So use both ideas in tandem. The problem then is really obvious. How do we know that the vegetation changes we cause don’t then act to reduce further rainfall? The issue becomes climate engineering then as well.
If you are going to do something, you need to understand the consequences of your actions. Theory > Measure > Plan > Implement, then loop back again: the scientific method.
Kinkajou : There’s no point doing things, then finding that you actions are triggering compensations which negate the effects of what you are trying to do. Back to theoretical gravity, not its practical applications.
Gravity Effects Field
Erasmus : Learning to generate gravity demands a lot of understanding of the sub nuclear processes that create gravity.
- For a start, do all atoms produce gravity in direct proportion to their mass?
- Are there atomic structures e.g. the transuranic elements which generate different quantities of gravity than would be inferred from their structure alone.
- There are some thoughts that perhaps antimatter generates different quantities of gravity to normal matter.
Hopefully, our research into particle physics through the Hadron colliders begin to give us some understanding of the issues and may begin to show us a path towards the goal of generating gravity.
Coriolis Force : Simulated Gravity
Kinkajou : Sci-Fi often talks about Gravity generators or Gravito-magnetism.
Erasmus : In science-fiction artificial gravity, contra gravity or pseudo-gravity is often described in spacecraft. Currently, humanity possesses no technique to create gravity other than the possession of actual mass
Gravity like effects can occur with a rotating sphere of reference generating Coriolis or centrifugal force, or generation of linear acceleration. These are not gravity. Gravity can be simulated in numerous ways:
Neutral buoyancy in a pool is not weightlessness, since the balance organs in the inner ear still sense the up-down direction of gravity. Also, there is a significant amount of drag presented by water.
Artificial gravity is likely to be an essential part of space travel. Human being’s muscles and bones are dependent on the presence of gravity to maintain their structure.
While gravity can be generated by centrifugal force or even by linear acceleration, (both really being “fictitious forces”), these are unlikely to be a realistic option for long term space travel. Coriolis force acts as a centrifugal force in a rotating reference frame. This artificial gravity varies in an inverse square relationship with the distance from the centre of rotation.
So in a small spaceship the amount of gravity felt at one’s head would be significantly different than what is felt at one’s feet. Coriolis force can cause dizziness nausea and disorientation. At rotation rates above seven RPM few people seem to accustom well or easily to Coriolis or centrifugal forces. Again is not known whether prolonged exposure breeds acclimatisation. Weightlessness affects the body in many different ways, not necessarily in healthy ones.
Human beings and animals all undergo adaptations to weightlessness in space. Bone density decreases over a very long period of time and it is possible that some of this decrease may well be permanent.
There are classes of medicines used to treat osteoporosis which can stabilise calcium loss from trabecular bone. The minimum amount of Gravity Force or gravity required to prevent bone density changes is currently not known. Most of our experience with gravity is with G forces of 1G on the surface of the earth or 0G in orbit. Experience on the Moon may well give us more understanding of the effect of gravity on muscle and bone structure. However, until we have Moon colonies and have spent a substantial period time on the Moon, this answer remains unknown. (The Moon experiences about 0 .16G).
Kinkajou : Is using artificial (simulated) gravity in space ships really a viable option.
Erasmus : Probably not for a number of reasons. Spinning up a habitat uses energy . Spaceships are likely to need to be energy misers, due to the limited resources available and the need to maintain reserve to deal with crises.
Kinkajou : Yes. Imagine a diesel powered ship of today in the ocean 100 years ago. Where do you get diesel fuel when you run dry? And in the quantities required? In the USA, around the 1900s, kerosene was sold to the mass market in little tins. A ship needs "tanker style" volumes of fuel. Only a few places on the planet would have even had this type of hydrocarbon fuel available.
Erasmus : True. Ships out of port need to conserve resources. Next! Spinning up a ship creates its own problems.
Spinning in a zero reference frame environment will cause progressive perturbations unless these are damped by a Gyroscopic balancing system. Structures need to be reinforced, at least to some extent.
A layer of complexity to space structures may be added if parts of the structure are made intentionally not rotating. A motor and power will be required to drive the rotation. Gyroscopes will be needed to stabilise rotation.
This makes the structure much more complex. The problem with complex structures arises when things go wrong. Imagine if you are one light-year away from Earth and your centrifugal gravity generating system has ball bearings cracking due to radiation and temperature effects.
If you cannot build or replace the ball bearings affected, you may be forced to continue your journey without the benefit of any artificial gravity at all. Same effect if the motor goes down, “you can’t get parts”. The lack of artificial gravity may have serious consequences on physical capabilities at mission terminus.
Two RPM appears to give Coriolis forces substituting for gravity that are very well-tolerated by most people. To produce 1G of gravity at two RPM requires a radius of rotation of 220 m. This makes the spaceship very large indeed. While such a ship can generate gravity for good health, there is a low probability that this amount of living area can be radiation shielded adequately for biologicals.
.1 G of Coriolis force artificial gravity can be generated with a radius of rotation of22 m. This is much smaller but the question then is,” is this amount of gravity adequate to prevent health deterioration from lack of gravity?” It may be easier just to have a small centrifuge set up as an exercise area. (This in fact is a solution that has been chosen for a number of recent space missions).
Artificial Gravity Generation
Diamagnetic Force: Simulated Gravity
Erasmus : Dia-magnetism using extremely high strength magnetic fields has been used to levitate a small living frog, within magnetic field of 16 Tesla. This means that lift or pseudo gravity is being generated. The experimental system weighed several thousand kilos and required 6 MW of power.
However we don’t know how dangerous prolonged exposure to high-intensity magnetic fields is for humans. At minimum intense magnetism generates heating effects. Also intense magnetism causes isolation of protons within hydrogen atoms, possibly resulting in distortions or changes to biological molecules. Also we have not yet considered the issue of effect of prolonged magnetic exposure on structural spaceship components.
Kinkajou : We’re talking a lot about pseudo gravity. It looks like humanity is nowhere close to generating its own real gravity. We don’t understand how gravity is made. Our theories do not explain the relationship between gravity and electromagnetism. We have a long way to go.
Erasmus :CENSORED "ref ...................." by order of “Frobisher” authorised by “The Commandant”.
Magnetic Fields Planetary
UFOs and Gravity
Kinkajou : So what are the crazies saying?
Erasmus : there was a guy called Bob Lazar who began work in 1979 in what was known as Area 51 (or Groom Lake). He says the US acquired nine UFOs from extra-terrestrials and attempted to back engineer the ET technology. People commenting on the gravity generators described by Lazar have noted the gravity generator elements look exactly like the rings of optical lasers and magnetic traps used in BEC technology to slow down the atoms.
Skip to the future around about now. Recent research into Bose-Einstein condensate (BEC) has found that by slowing down a body of atoms, to within a fraction of a degree Kelvin (near absolute zero), they coalesce into a “superatom”.
When this “superatom” is excited by a specially designed oscillating field, it propagates matter waves. It is hoped that one day this technology will produce a tightly focused “matter wave beam” which can be directed (much like that of the laser light beam).
Kinkajou : This suggests the ET’s may be using BEC style technology to generate gravity.
Erasmus :: Lazar described the UFOs as using element 115 bombarded with protons to initiate antimatter production from by-products of the reaction, and thereby generating energy from the antimatter.
Unfortunately, this description has a ring of falsehood. This is a list of the elements in the region of atomic number 115 to 116. I have quoted their atomic symbol and stability times:
109 Meitnerium Mt 7.6 seconds
110 Darmstadtium Ds ~3.7 minutes
111 Roentgenium Rg 26 seconds
112 Copernicium Cn ~8.9 minutes
113 Ununtrium Uut 19.6 seconds
114 Flerovium Fl ~1.1 minutes
115 Ununpentium Uup 220 milliseconds
116 Livermorium Lv 61 milliseconds
117 Ununseptium Uus 78 milliseconds
118 Ununoctium Uuo 890 microseconds
All these isotopes are incredibly unstable with incredibly low half-lives.
Atoms of Periodic Table and their Sources
Kinkajou : Is there any way we can stabilise these atoms.
Erasmus : The only thing I think we can do is to supercool them. It doesn’t sound like it might make much difference. Maybe individualised gravity fields in a matrix format could compress the atomic nuclei with extra gravity, stabilising the atoms. All speculative, I’m afraid.
Kinkajou : Tell us more about these isotopes. All the serious UFO types seem to mention that the Aliens use these atoms or something like them in gravity generation.
Erasmus : I’ll just talk about the ones that seem to be mentioned by the UFO people.
Livermorium is a synthetic superheavy element which has only been created in a laboratory. Four isotopes of have been identified with mass numbers between 290 and 293 inclusive; the longest-lived among them is livermorium-293 with a half-life of about 60 milliseconds. Livermorium is calculated to have some similar properties to its lighter homologues, oxygen, sulphur, selenium, tellurium, and polonium. There may be different properties unique to this atom however.
Ununpentium is the temporary name of a synthetic super-heavy element in the periodic table atomic number 115. Its most stable known isotope, ununpentium-289, has a will half-life of only 220 ms (milliseconds). It is also known as eka-bismuth. Its structure is still awaiting confirmation by IUPAC. Ununpentium is calculated to have some similar properties to its lighter homologues, nitrogen, phosphorus, arsenic, antimony, and bismuth. There may be different properties unique to this atom however.
Measured (boxed) and predicted (shaded) half-lives of isotopes, sorted by number of protons and neutrons. The expected location of the island of stability is circled.
Island of Atomic Isotope Stability
Erasmus There has been some speculation that a stable island of transuranic elements does exist and that these can be utilised in exotic physics. One example of such would be the generation of gravity. However, the reality of our knowledge of these elements predicts that they cannot be used in situation in which they are described to be used.
Perhaps however super cooling these elements may stabilise them. Perhaps, there are different isotopes in the family with different neutral numbers which may have altered stability. Perhaps these atoms can be stabilised within particular “fields” compose a strong week magnetic forces which are externally generated from the atoms themselves. (I.e. by us).
Erasmus RF engineers have commented on Lazar’s design. It appears to look like a circular cross-section waveguide for high frequency waves, perhaps relating to the microwave region. Whatever the target is, (115 or 116 or other), hitting the target with these microwaves most likely causes the electrons in the target gases to resonate and greatly increases the energy level. The question then becomes “what is the relationship between electron orbitals and atomic nuclei and gravity?” Obviously we need a theory and some practical experience.
Bob Lazar has also stated publicly that the craft with which he was familiar does not create an antigravity field. It generates a gravitational field that is out of phase with the current one, but it is the same gravitational wave. So if we add a gravity wave 90 - 180° out of sync with itself the newly created gravity force can be made stronger or weaker than the existing one.
He is saying that if you created the same current-magnetic field combination for the gravity wave (at the same amplitude) but altered the phase to below 90º you would become lighter, and by altering the phase to between 90º and 180º you would be heavier ... Sounds interesting. Is this like selective constructive and destructive interference between two radiating waves maybe?
Kinkajou : This also has a ring of bullshit. Why should gravity waves emanating from the planet Earth all be in sync? Gravity we believe is generated by each individual bit of matter. Why should it acquire a laser like property?
The real situation is somewhat more akin to light shining from the sun. There is a lot of light shining from the sun but temperature is not coherent, i.e. not laser like. Generating an out of sync wave to add to the sun’s light is essentially impossible as each individual photon is likely to be out of sync with other photons to a variable extent.
There may be some aspects of gravity generation which are more wavelike which defy the above analogy. Also, non-coherent wave patterns would act together to form interference spectra. I don’t think there has been any evidence of this occurring. It is unlikely that we could manipulate this type of gravity output by the planet earth with an out of sync coherent gravity generator.
Erasmus : When you think about it, Lazar’s statements does have the effluvium of “hard to take seriously””.
Kinkajou : OK. I agree.
Erasmus : Bob Lazar has also stated that the gravity wave generators propagate the energy beam through the shell of the craft downwards. It has been suggested possible that the hull of the craft could be used as a lens for focusing electromagnetic waves or also to regulate the shape of the ways to give a predetermined delay between one beam and another.
Honeycomb structure in the metal of the hull of the spaceship could achieve this purpose. By altering the delay between beams, an interference pattern can be set up with areas of highly intense effects being generated.
Kinkajou : Hopefully stay pointed up or you might fall out of the sky.
Erasmus : Bob Lazar also stated that the UFOs came from a star system called Zeta Reticuli. Zeta Reticuli is a wide binary star system in the southern constellation of Reticulum. From the southern hemisphere the pair can be seen as a naked eye double star in very dark skies.
Based upon parallax measurements, this system is located at a distance of about 39 light-years (12 parsecs) from the Earth. Zeta Reticuli is orbited by a circumstellar debris disk. Both stars are solar analogs that share similar characteristics with the Sun.
Quote: The disc is one of nine, given to the American government in an ‘exchange’ program in the early 1970’s. The makers of the craft and providers of the fuel were from the Zeta Reticuli star system. What we exchanged for the technology is not known. A back engineering program began in 1979 of the remaining hardware and technology.”
Erasmus : CENSORED "ref ...................." by order of “Frobisher” authorised by “The Commandant”.
Erasmus : It has been said that it is difficult to back engineer technology. It is only possible if that aspect of technology falls within a narrow band of similar expertise, allowing you to make the next step. For example, if you gave a computer CPU chip to a Roman Soldier, how much back engineering could he do? If you gave a gene engineered sheep to a Sumerian, could he back engineer that.
Spaceship Antigravity Generator
Kinkajou : If you just feed the sheep, they replicate easily. You can study it and back engineer it all a few thousand years later, if you had the urge.
Erasmus : Your point being that we may be some way from the point at which we can even understand this technology. Still Knowledge that it is possible is valuable in itself and would serve as an inspiration for technological study and hopefully breakthrough. Let’s go on.
Erasmus : European researchers have measured the gravitational equivalent of a magnetic field for the first time in the laboratory. Martin Tajmar (ARC Seibersdorf Research GmbH, Austria), Clovis de Matos (ESA-HQ, Paris) and colleagues have successfully produced and measured a very weak gravito-magnetic field.
They summarize their results as follows:
An acceleration field was found to be induced by applying angular accelerations to a superconductor. The field produced is directly proportional to the applied acceleration. All mean values are 3.3 times above the facility noise level.
The gravitational field is emitted from the superconductor and follows the laws of field propagation and induction similar to those of electromagnetism as formulated in linearized general relativity. Gravitational peaks were observed when the superconductor passed its critical temperature while it was rotating. Their sign changed with the orientation of the angular velocity.
For the first time, non-Newtonian gravitational and gravito-magnetic fields of measurable magnitude were observed in a laboratory environment. The existence of the gravitational Faraday law was shown. (The issue here is the inverse square relationship being demonstrated, and mimicking electromagnetic induction fields.)
Kinkajou : I think scientists recently detected gravitational ripples propagating at the speed of light. The detector had two long arms at right angles. So a gravitational ripple stretches one arm. We can measure the change in path length caused by this distortion/ stretching of space by the gravity waves.
Erasmus : I remember hearing about it on the news.
Kinkajou : Tell us about other claims regarding producing artificial gravity.
There have been many claims over the years of such a device. Eugene Podkletnov, a Russian engineer, has claimed since the early 1990s to have made such a device consisting of a spinning superconductor producing a powerful gravito-magnetic field, but there has been no verification or even negative results from third parties.
In 2006, a research group funded by ESA claimed to have created a similar device that demonstrated positive results for the production of gravito-magnetism, although it produced only 100 millionths of 1g.( 1g = force of earth gravity, giving an acceleration of 9.8 m/s/s). String theory predicts that gravity and electromagnetism unify in some way.
Kinkajou : So tell us Goo, what have you learned?
Goo : The human race appears to have its work cut out here. The mechanics of exactly how gravity is generated by matter need to be appreciated. There is considerable theoretical work needs to be done before electromagnetic and gravitic field generation are reconciled in the framework of some theory.
Even if there is no theory, there is plenty of scope for understanding through experimentation. Most of our theories arise from observations, so its a good thing to start with to develop expertise. The information needs to get known. Tell people, especially people with knowledge, so they can think about it. Its sort of like realising that no matter how low the odds may be of winning the Lotto, they are much much worse if you are not in the draw and don't have a ticket.
The stakes are high. Knowing how to control and generate gravity opens many of doors for the human race.
I’d like to comment on the Paill+ theory proposed by Dr Xxxxx. Human IQ limitations imposed by the Paill organism may make the solution of complex problems impossible.
Erasmus : CENSORED "ref ...................." by order of “Frobisher” authorised by “The Commandant”.
Gravity is Falling